1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:29,000 This is the video called a Combergus video, which is a close-up of a craft. 2 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:57,000 The Pentagon now confirms the existence of a secretive UFO program investigating reports of unidentified flying objects. 3 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:03,000 I remember when I woke up the day it came out, it was a bombshell, right? That's what it was. 4 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:10,000 This is it. This is when the government, the military, is going to come out and reveal the truth behind what these UFOs are. 5 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:18,000 I believe, as do the other folks that were on the flight, that it was something not from this world. 6 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:23,000 The question, do you believe in UFOs, really doesn't make any sense. There's no issue of belief there. 7 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:25,000 How is our aliens? 8 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:27,000 Look, they're stopping. 9 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,000 Literally what the actual f*** is going on. 10 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:36,000 You have people experiencing something that they don't quite understand. 11 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,000 My God! 12 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,000 It's a new thing! 13 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,000 When this whole thing started, I tried to tell people about it. 14 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:54,000 I was really frustrated because no one seemed to care. 15 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:57,000 This thing almost killed me, man. 16 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:11,000 The UFO world is just crazy. Everybody has their own turf. 17 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:41,000 I chose to move to Las Vegas on a coin flip. 18 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:47,000 Just flat out luck that I happened to be in the right place at the right time and got to meet the right people. 19 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:55,000 Investigators say they're having a tough time identifying the four people killed in a plane crash in Arizona today because there isn't much left to ID. 20 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:57,000 I've done thousands and thousands of stories. 21 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:02,000 In Mississippi, a man says he's killed at least 60 other people and wants to be given the death penalty. 22 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:04,000 I've won two Peabodies. 23 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:07,000 George Dab has a story for us. 24 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:18,000 Residents of the exclusive Sienna Village Golf Course Community have got to be shaking their heads in disbelief right about now because of a prostitution ring that has allegedly been operating right under their noses. 25 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:20,000 But I will always be the UFO guy. 26 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:26,000 In some cases, it does appear that various government officials have withheld information about UFOs from the public. 27 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:32,000 Wherever I go, I'm in a grocery store, I'm in a restaurant, I'm in a bar, I'm standing at a urinal. 28 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:35,000 People want to come up and talk to me about UFOs. 29 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:42,000 These days, the locals use these old airstrips to race dragsters at the old hangars as an industrial park. 30 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:48,000 But 42 years ago, this is where it all began, the birthplace of what some have called the Cosmic Water Game. 31 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:52,000 A key player in this entire story is a journalist by the name of George Dab. 32 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:56,000 His name now is really connected to the ATIP story. 33 00:03:56,000 --> 00:04:02,000 We've been working on this story for a long time and we'll tell you right up front that it's going to be hard to swallow at first. 34 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:06,000 George has contributed immensely to the UFO field for quite a few years. 35 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:15,000 That's because George is able to gain access to reports, sometimes official documents and key players. 36 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:19,000 You know, George, I'll have to look at this. I have heard about this exact story. 37 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:25,000 I will tell you this, 95% of it is bullshit, but the other 5% is really interesting. 38 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:32,000 And if it's true, it would be the biggest story of all time. If it is true, if even a little bit of it is true, it's gigantic. 39 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:35,000 The implications are enormous for everyone. 40 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:53,000 The Air Force has said time and time again, all but a small percentage of these reports of unidentified flying objects have been definitely attributed to natural phenomena that are neither mysterious nor dire and close. 41 00:04:53,000 --> 00:05:02,000 The top Air Force intelligence men and scientists under contract sent a secret document to the commanding general of the Air Force saying that whatever these things were, they were real. 42 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:12,000 And they have been spending a lot of money investigating flying saucers. If they don't exist, why the money? Why did the intelligence teams rush out every time there's a sighting? 43 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:22,000 There's a white glowing object in the sky. It might have been a spaceship. It might not have been. I would say since it did appear to approach us, it might have been. 44 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:28,000 It was the strangest thing I've ever seen. By far the strangest I've ever seen in a few years of reporting. 45 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:38,000 I just saw the round front and I could see the light on either side. And then the red light was sort of casting a glow over the whole thing so it looked like a round disk. 46 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:44,000 I wasn't afraid. I just wanted to stay there and keep my eyes glued to it. I couldn't believe it. 47 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:53,000 And then it seemed to just go together and make a ball and fly out into that field and it was a great big huge yellow glow out there. 48 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:01,000 Mike. 49 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:02,000 That's a coffee. 50 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:03,000 Some coffee? Coffee please? 51 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:04,000 Yeah. 52 00:06:04,000 --> 00:06:06,000 You started out as a cab driver, is that right? 53 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:12,000 I was a debate coach in the Bay Area and I met these bartenders from Las Vegas and they were the craziest people I'd ever met. 54 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:23,000 They told me, you know, we know a guy in television in Las Vegas. You should go there. You can break into television. That was 1979. 55 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:32,000 I drove a cab for a couple of months and I was terrible on it. 56 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:39,000 All I knew was where the airport was, I knew where the strip was. 57 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:49,000 I had no idea about the Nevada nuclear test site or the secret programs that were out there. I certainly had no idea there was a place called Area 51. 58 00:06:55,000 --> 00:07:01,000 I look at it and I realized and I was cocky at the time, what this field needs is a good investigative reporter. 59 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,000 I'll have this wrapped up in like six months. 60 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:10,000 Have UFOs been given a fair shake by science, journalism and the government? 61 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:15,000 George Knapp joins us now with part one of the cover story series UFOs, The Best Evidence. 62 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:17,000 I've banged away at this story for decades. 63 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:25,000 There is now a sagging amount of information on this subject collected not by crackpots, but by respected mainstream level headed people. 64 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:30,000 We stopped at Edwards Air Force Base to record video for a future project. 65 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:36,000 Edwards has a distinct relationship with its more mysterious cousin in Nevada, Area 51. 66 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:41,000 And then bam, The New York Times does the story. It changed everything. 67 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:47,000 A recent report by The New York Times unveiled the existence of a real life X-Files department. 68 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:51,000 Now the Pentagon tells us the program received more than $20 million for its work, 69 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:58,000 which included analyzing reports from military pilots of encounters with unknown objects that appear to defy the laws of physics. 70 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:02,000 A couple of weeks before the story came out, I had heard it was going to happen. 71 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:06,000 And of course, by that point, I'd been sitting on some of this information for a number of years. 72 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:13,000 I go, well, why can't I break the story? I've been sitting on this. I've been, you know, I've kept my word. I want to do it. 73 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:15,000 So I got a call from Perry Reed. 74 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:22,000 He gently sort of let me know, you know, you're not The New York Times. 75 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:28,000 There is a secret UFO program inside the Department of Defense on the front page of The New York Times. 76 00:08:30,000 --> 00:08:36,000 The New York Times is not pro UFO. This is not something they like to cover on a regular basis. 77 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:41,000 If I do the story, it's just the UFO reporter doing the story. 78 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:47,000 It would fall with a thud and nobody would pay attention to it. So I backed off. Yeah, go ahead. 79 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:53,000 We're still feeling the reverberations. 80 00:08:53,000 --> 00:09:00,000 There's now a report that will be issued by the Pentagon, by the Secretary of Defense and the Director of National Intelligence. 81 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:04,000 I actually wanted to get this information out and declassified before I left office. 82 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:09,000 But when that information becomes declassified, I'll be able to talk a little bit more about that. 83 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:18,000 The Department of Defense has been studying UFOs since 2007. That's what the story was. 84 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:28,000 The actual article was really based on things I learned from the director of the program and interviews that we did with other players involved with ATIP. 85 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:33,000 The Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program. 86 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:38,000 I'm aware that the organization was up and running. I didn't know what the program was called. 87 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:44,000 I had never heard the name ATIP and I didn't know who Lou Elizondo was. I knew there was somebody who was working on this stuff. 88 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:52,000 Mr. Luis Elizondo talked about running a program that dealt with unidentified aerial phenomena or UFOs. 89 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:57,000 The Pentagon was interested in it. They were investigating it and he was the guy that led it. 90 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:02,000 According to Mr. Luis Elizondo, ATIP looked at videos. 91 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:10,000 When a military pilot saw something they couldn't explain, ATIP was going to come aboard and try and figure it out. 92 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:24,000 It was originally instigated by the Defense Intelligence Agency and Harry Reid, the senator from Nevada, was very instrumental in setting it up. 93 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,000 Okay, you guys ready? 94 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:29,000 Yep, rolling. 95 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:34,000 When I was asked by a reporter from the New York Times, I said, I'm happy to do an interview with you. 96 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:38,000 I want some ground rules. We're not going to be talking about a little green man. 97 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:51,000 I will only talk about scientific issues and I recognize that what I got started here was kind of taking a chance, but I think it's paid off. 98 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:58,000 The remarkable admission by the Pentagon came as a result of reporting by the New York Times. Pretty august publication. 99 00:10:58,000 --> 00:11:05,000 This is not birds. It's not somebody else's plane. It's picked up on radar. It's real. 100 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:11,000 Can you imagine the steps they had to go through to sell that story to the editors about UFOs? 101 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:17,000 Tough sell. 102 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:23,000 I don't think most people realize what's involved in putting together a story like this. 103 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:29,000 This was one of the most exciting things that had come out in a long time. 104 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:39,000 The entire basis of all of my research up until that point was proving that the U.S. military did have an interest in UFOs. 105 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:43,000 And this man and what he did was that smoking gun. 106 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:52,000 For nearly the last decade, I ran a sensitive aerospace threat identification program focusing on unidentified aerial technologies. 107 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:59,000 It was in this position I learned that the phenomenon is indeed real. 108 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:10,000 I was shown three videos that had come from the Department of Defense and also the documents that showed that the videos were legitimate. 109 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:18,000 I never said this before in public, but this report, the executive summary of the TIC-TAC incident, started at the Navy. 110 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:24,000 There was an initial investigation after the incident itself back in 2004. 111 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:31,000 The commander of that carrier strike force, that carrier group, didn't want to delay going to the Persian Gulf. 112 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:37,000 So whatever information was gathered back then got tossed into a drawer and closed and it was going to be forgotten. 113 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,000 And then a couple years later, some people in the Navy renewed the investigation. 114 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:50,000 It bounced around inside the Pentagon and the intelligence community and then ended up at ATEM. 115 00:12:50,000 --> 00:13:10,000 How is it that you feel that talking about this is serving your country? 116 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:14,000 I've been gravely concerned about what happened for me. 117 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:18,000 I guess 15 years ago this week, 2004. 118 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:25,000 And when it first happened, I was trying to tell people, you know, my chain of command and others, but no one seemed to really believe me. 119 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:30,000 And it really, really bugged me and it started manifesting in the nightmares. 120 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,000 And I didn't know what the hell it would do, you know. 121 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,000 I wasn't really prepared for that day. 122 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:49,000 Our command on USS Princeton, we were the air defense commander for the Nimitz strike group. 123 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:54,000 Anything that flies, as soon as I gain it on radar, I'm actively trying to figure out what it is. 124 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:58,000 Is it high and fast? Is it low and slow? Is it on a commercial air route? 125 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:02,000 We put all these little pieces of the puzzle together to come up with an identification. 126 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:08,000 In 2004, we were off the coast of California doing a standard training cycle. 127 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:13,000 And I noticed these really strange tracks off the coast of Catalina. 128 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:22,000 Those things were up at 28,000 feet. They were kind of in a loose group and they were all tracking down 100 knots, 28,000 feet towards the south, really, really slow. 129 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:26,000 Usually something that high going that slow is going to fall out of the sky. 130 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:33,000 You can't create enough lift to stay airborne. So I knew there were something anomalous. 131 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:42,000 I was up in the CIC in Combat Information Center and I was standing in a position on a watch called Anti-Airworth Air Coordinator, A-A-W-C. 132 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:48,000 And that position is the guy that actually presses the button to shoot a missile if you have to. 133 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,000 You know all of our systems are automated but they're not automatic. 134 00:14:52,000 --> 00:15:01,000 So it's a person like myself that has to take all the pieces of information and actually use my brain and tell everyone else what the identification is. 135 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:11,000 Man, I'm telling you. It's probably the only air contact that I've ever detected and tracked on Spy Radar that I was never able to identify. 136 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,000 And I still want to make that identification. That's why I'm here today. 137 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:33,000 I know it's been several years and it's a difficult topic. 138 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:38,000 I think it's difficult for some of the guys but I've never had a problem talking about it. I can only tell you what I know. 139 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:44,000 So 13 years after this took place it was published on the front pages of the New York Times. 140 00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:51,000 Ironically, I didn't even see any of that. I didn't see the New York Times. I didn't know anything about it. 141 00:15:51,000 --> 00:16:01,000 Then out of the blue I got a message from Kevin telling me that one of our shipmates had come out to talk about the event. 142 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:06,000 He didn't even have to say what event. He already knew. The event event? 143 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:13,000 I kind of went, now I'm like, people are actually going to believe us now. 144 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:22,000 I was on USS Princeton CG-59. It's a guided missile cruiser. 145 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:27,000 I was a computer technician so I handled all the main frames, data recording. 146 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:30,000 All the systems run off of my system. 147 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:37,000 We were seeing flying objects that we were tracking on the radar which is why we call them tracks. 148 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:45,000 And they were just flying due south at 100 knots on and off for seven days. 149 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:48,000 They just appear, disappear. 150 00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:57,000 After the third day I got an idea that it might be close enough to just barely see it through these big huge binoculars attached to the side of the ship. 151 00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,000 They're called big eyes. 152 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:05,000 It was basically just a dock in the horizon at the right bearing and the right altitude. 153 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:08,000 And I was just waiting to see if it moved or did anything and sure enough it did. 154 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:12,000 At a certain point it moved over to the side and then just gone. 155 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:20,000 I became concerned. So Cap comes down to combat and says, hey sir, we've been tracking these things for a few days now. 156 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:25,000 And I strongly recommend that we get an aircraft to launch and intercept it. 157 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:32,000 And none of us were prepared for what happened when that happened. 158 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:45,000 This was not the usual New York Times story. 159 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,000 What does that mean? 160 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:52,000 All along the UFO debate has been whether these things are real or not. 161 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,000 I'm not sure. 162 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,000 I don't know. 163 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,000 I don't know. 164 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:00,000 I don't know. 165 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,000 I don't know. 166 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,000 I don't know. 167 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,000 I don't know. 168 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,000 I don't know. 169 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:10,000 I don't know. 170 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:15,000 The New York Times story about the UFO debate has been whether these things are real or not real. 171 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,000 In other words, are they a figment of the imagination? 172 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:22,000 Are they some psychological phenomenon that has no physical reality? 173 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:28,000 And what was most interesting in the reporting that Leslie and I and Helene did for the New York Times 174 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,000 was that the most highly trained observers that exist, Navy pilots, 175 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:35,000 the government spends millions of dollars training them. 176 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,000 They're not mentally deficient. 177 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:39,000 They're not physical aberrations. 178 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:42,000 These people are trusted with the most powerful weapons in our arsenal. 179 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:45,000 They've seen them with their eyes. 180 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:52,000 Both airplanes see a disturbance in the water and a white 40-foot-long, tic-tac-shaped object. 181 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:54,000 The controller starts talking to us. 182 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:57,000 He says, hey, sir, we've seen these objects. 183 00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:00,000 We need you to go investigate. We want to know what these are. 184 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:05,000 So they got to a point where they say, hey, merge plot. 185 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:11,000 He gets into the merge plot position, which is basically two objects in the same vertical piece of sky. 186 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:15,000 A two-dimensional display now looks like one object. 187 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:21,000 As we're looking around, we look to the right and we see white water. 188 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:27,000 What we see is this white, tic-tac-looking object just above the surface of the water, 189 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,000 pointing north-south, and it's going north-south east-west. 190 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,000 It's just radically moving forward, back, left, right at will. 191 00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:37,000 I go, dude, do you see that? What is that thing? 192 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:40,000 We're looking down at this thing and I said, I'm going to go check it out. 193 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:44,000 So I start driving around just in a nice, easy descent. 194 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:50,000 As I'm coming down, the tic-tac starts coming up. 195 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:52,000 I'm like, well, this is getting interesting. 196 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:58,000 All of a sudden we hear on the radio, oh my god, oh my god, I'm engaged, I'm engaged. 197 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,000 And whatever that object was, the thing seemed to recognize him. 198 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:07,000 It actually got in a dog fight with him. 199 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:12,000 The target started moving left and right at very jagged angles, 200 00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:17,000 and then it would disappear off the screen and come back onto the screen. 201 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,000 It's kind of starting to cross my nose and it starts to accelerate, 202 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:23,000 and within less than a second, it crosses right in front of me. 203 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:27,000 It just goes poof and it's gone. 204 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:32,000 I can tell you the reaction on the ship was total befuddlement. 205 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:35,000 Total bebop, but we didn't know what to think. 206 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:42,000 What flies like that? Nothing I'd ever seen. Not even close. 207 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:46,000 After that happened, my mind changed a little bit. 208 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:50,000 I decided, yeah, these are probably UFOs that I'd always heard about 209 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:56,000 and identified flying objects. 210 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,000 I went up to a machine that's called the RD-390, 211 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,000 and it records all of our external communications onto an optical disc. 212 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:05,000 Just in case something like this happens, 213 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:12,000 an investigator can go back, play it back, and figure out what the hell happened, right? 214 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:19,000 Well, I went back up to combat, and all the comms were gone. 215 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:23,000 And I could tell by looking at the lead technician, I'm not going to say what his name is, 216 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,000 because I'm hoping it'll still come out. 217 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:31,000 I could tell by looking at him that he knew what had happened, but he couldn't tell me. 218 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:35,000 The whole thing kind of got swept under the carpet pretty quickly 219 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:39,000 by the strike group commander, and even by my own captain, 220 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:46,000 which kind of pissed me off, actually. 221 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:51,000 We were completely defenseless against these things. 222 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:56,000 All that data gets reported down in my computer room on optical discs. 223 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:01,000 The helicopter landed. Two people got out, and 20 minutes later, 224 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:08,000 I was asked to get all the tapes, get them all, everything in the computer room that had anything on it. 225 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:13,000 And so I had to bring all the tapes down there, and those guys were in there. 226 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:17,000 The civilian clothes, you know, no men in black or any weird things like that, 227 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:22,000 but nondescript civilian clothes, just like me and you were wearing now. 228 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:26,000 All of those discs were taken. That was given to my chain of command 229 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:32,000 and then given to somebody that brought them off ship. 230 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:36,000 This is all supposed to keep secret. None of this material was being made public. 231 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:41,000 The problem that's been since the beginning is this is my information, and you can't have it. 232 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:45,000 And the people who have it consider it to be theirs, and don't want to share it. 233 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:49,000 Not with the Air Force, not with the Navy, not with the CIA, it's theirs. 234 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:54,000 And it's sort of for the purpose of plausible deniability. 235 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,000 If they didn't want it out, they wouldn't have released it. 236 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:06,000 It took a number of years, but somebody in the Navy made it possible. 237 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:13,000 Well, after the December 2017 story, which was a bombshell, we continued working on it. 238 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:20,000 It took us a year and a half to come up with a good follow-up. 239 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:28,000 And the other story we came up with was that in 2015, the Roosevelt had encounters between Navy pilots and UFOs, 240 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:37,000 which incidentally, Helene, our partner, she was actually embedded on the Theater Roosevelt for a story on its mission in the Gulf. 241 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:51,000 The incidences at the Roosevelt, there were lots of sightings of these very strange, kind of smallish objects of different types. 242 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,000 And a lot of them were picked up on radar. 243 00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:57,000 Hey, hey, hey! 244 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:12,000 They were different. They weren't like these tic-tacs that were buzzing around, but they could pick them up just for long periods of time. 245 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,000 That's not how that stuff is. That's not how they're gonna understand. 246 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:21,000 But if there's a good thing, it's rotate. 247 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:31,000 We had two pilots that went on the record. We spoke to five others who would not put their names on the record. 248 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:38,000 Again, they're all afraid to talk about it publicly, and it was very difficult to even get two to talk to us. 249 00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:42,000 The Navy says it still doesn't know what the objects are, and officials are in speculating. 250 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:51,000 A Navy spokesman simply confirming to CNN the objects seen in the various clips are unidentified aerial phenomena, or UAPs. 251 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:58,000 The conversation has finally moved, folks, from the fringe. So congratulations, you succeeded. 252 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:07,000 For some folks, the article that came out in the New York Times is the very first time they've ever actually even considered this topic. 253 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:16,000 After the New York Times story comes out, we start producing stories about ATIN, the program that Lou Elizondo worked for. 254 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:24,000 I traveled to Washington to meet with Senator Reid. It was like a secret agent thing. I changed hotels. I changed cabs. 255 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:31,000 Because I knew that Senator Reid was very sensitive. I was just trying to be cautious. 256 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:38,000 George and I have been interested in this for a long time, and for decades we've shared information. 257 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:46,000 He was going to help me understand the bigger picture on this. So I had the meeting, Senator Reid, and I had a general idea about ATIN. 258 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:52,000 I didn't know that there had been another program that had started out as something else that had been OSAP. 259 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:59,000 And I was shown the contract for the creation of OSAP, the Advanced Aerospace Weapons Systems Application Program. 260 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:05,000 That was the name of the program that was created by the DIA, the Defense Intelligence Agency. 261 00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:13,000 It was dark money, black money. Even members of Congress don't know it's there because there would have been such criticism. 262 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:20,000 Why are they studying flying saucers? We wanted to make sure that it was put out to bid, and it was. 263 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:31,000 They let out a contract. BASS is the company that got contract. 22 million dollars is given to BASS, Bigelow Advanced Aerospace Systems, 264 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:38,000 an organization created by this guy, Robert Bigelow. I've seen so many crazy stories about him. 265 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:49,000 Meet Robert Bigelow, a real estate developer who made his fortune building a chain of low-cost, an acronym for Bigelow Expandable Activity Minds. 266 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:53,000 Those are the big dreams one local business owner has. 267 00:26:53,000 --> 00:27:00,000 Robert Bigelow is a billionaire, Las Vegas businessman. At one point he had more hotel rooms than the MGM grant here. 268 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:06,000 Everybody knew Bob. He's more at home on the Vegas Strip than at America's Space Agency. 269 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:11,000 Bob Bigelow is a very conservative Republican, so on political issues we didn't agree on much. 270 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:20,000 But he was a self-made, multi-millionaire. He spent a number of years of his life being inquisitive of what this is all about, 271 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,000 and he has the money to play around with it a little bit. 272 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:26,000 Do you believe that UFOs have come to Earth? 273 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:30,000 There has been and is an existing presence, an 18 presence. 274 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:37,000 Now I spent millions and millions. I probably spent more as an individual than anybody else in the United States have ever spent on this subject. 275 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:43,000 Robert Bigelow has been a really important figure for years and years on UFOs. 276 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:47,000 He develops technology for traveling into space. 277 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:56,000 You have these guys like Branson and Musk trying to tap into this commercialization of space travel and space exploration. 278 00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:01,000 It's a very small list of names. You can count Robert Bigelow up there as well. 279 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:08,000 NASA has partnered with Robert Bigelow, who's an unconventional figure in the aerospace world. 280 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,000 He's obsessed with aliens and UFOs. 281 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:18,000 We did report in our 2017 article, Bigelow saying that he believed in aliens. I mean, he believes that. 282 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:19,000 Do you believe in aliens? 283 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,000 I'm absolutely convinced that's all there is to it. 284 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:27,000 We felt it was only fair to give his full context because if we hadn't someone would say, 285 00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:32,000 yeah, Bigelow believes in aliens, you didn't mention that. So we said, yes, he's made statements in the past. 286 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:37,000 You don't worry that some people will say that you hear that guy? Sounds like he's crazy. 287 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:38,000 I don't care. 288 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:39,000 Why not? 289 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:43,000 It's not going to make a difference. It's not going to change reality of what I know. 290 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:50,000 I know the guy and I know about Bass. I mean, Bob Bigelow announced it on my radio show. 291 00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:56,000 The mission for this company is to pursue exotic novel technologies. 292 00:28:56,000 --> 00:29:01,000 As you know, George, there's probably nothing more difficult that you could tackle than this kind of a problem. 293 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:13,000 Bigelow has a very interesting history that predates the A-Tip story. 294 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:19,000 The number of years before Bass, he made up his own UFO organization called NIDS, 295 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,000 the National Institute for Discovery Science. 296 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:29,000 1995, he puts this together and brings a number of really distinguished academics. 297 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:34,000 A couple of guys who had worked for the CIA, there were two astronauts. 298 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:42,000 The colonel who had done his own attempts to get to the bottom of the UFO mystery from inside the Pentagon. 299 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:49,000 NIDS aimed to investigate claims of the paranormal, not only UFOs, but some other things. 300 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:58,000 1995, Bigelow puts NIDS together, spoke to that first meeting in 1996, made a presentation, 301 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:02,000 and my jaw is dropping and looking around the room at who these people were. 302 00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:07,000 That's when Skinwalker Ranch enters the picture. 303 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:23,000 A lot of the stuff on Skinwalker Ranch is very, very difficult to understand. 304 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:27,000 There have been things reported up there for generations. 305 00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:34,000 We know that Robert Bigelow wanted to investigate Skinwalker Ranch. 306 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:44,000 That ranch is a 480-acre ranch that's located in northeastern Utah, in an area known as the Uinta Basin. 307 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:48,000 Four decades now, that's where the NIDS is located. 308 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:55,000 In fact, some of the legend dates back more than 15 generations into Native American lore, 309 00:30:55,000 --> 00:31:01,000 and they talk about a shape-shifting witch known as the Uinta Basin. 310 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:08,000 The story is about the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS. 311 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:15,000 The NIDS is a story about the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS, the NIDS. 312 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:19,000 And they talk about a shape-shifting witch known as the Skinwalker. 313 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:28,000 The Native Americans, they wanted to avoid that area altogether because of what they were seeing in the sky and on the ground. 314 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,000 In the mid-1990s, a family moved into the property. 315 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,000 I spent quite a bit of time talking to Terry Sherman, and he was the owner. 316 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:40,000 He and his wife and two children lived there. 317 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:47,000 They operated the ranch, and they had a phenomenal diversity of encounters. 318 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:52,000 Really strange stuff off the chart, strange. Balls of light. 319 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:56,000 There's no flashes to it. It's just a solid light. 320 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,000 The ground would shake. 321 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:07,000 They would hear these disembodied voices speaking in languages they didn't understand. 322 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:12,000 It's like a haunted house with UFOs. 323 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:19,000 And then the animal mutilation started. 324 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:28,000 The rancher, I think, had first felt that somebody was trying to drive him off the property. 325 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:30,000 There was an article in a newspaper. 326 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:36,000 A local newspaper had done a story about it, because the rancher was trying to figure out what the heck is going on. 327 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:44,000 By the time that Bigelow hears about it, they were scared. They were so messed up. 328 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,000 They'd been through psychological hell. 329 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:54,000 They wanted out, so Bigelow went up, met with a family, and Bigelow offers to buy the property. 330 00:32:55,000 --> 00:33:00,000 Terry and I made a deal providing he would stay on, because I need somebody there. 331 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:05,000 In addition, he had backyard literally, backyard knowledge. 332 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:13,000 There was an episode with the ranch manager after Terry. 333 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:16,000 I heard some other folks, some wonderful people. 334 00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:26,000 I was 32 years with the military in various forms. 335 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:30,000 I spent most of the time in special operations, intelligence. 336 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:36,000 I got to higher and higher levels in the government. 337 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:43,000 I had met a number of people who were interested in UFOs. 338 00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:51,000 The opportunity came along for Bob to buy the ranch. 339 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:57,000 I was with him the day he bought it, and it was the first one to spend a night up there. 340 00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:04,000 John Alexander is a counterintelligence guy. He's like an actual man in black guy. 341 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:10,000 He's interested in these topics, and just wants to get to the bottom of it, like we all do. 342 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:19,000 We set up NIDS, National Institute for Discovery Science, and started exploring it. 343 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:25,000 The camera was 24-7 looking out at the events at the ranch. 344 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:39,000 Just amazing phenomena that absolutely occur, totally beyond explanation. 345 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:44,000 Frequently, things would happen just off camera, as if it knew where it was. 346 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:52,000 Other things happened that should have been on camera there weren't. 347 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:55,000 Very strange place. 348 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:14,000 I'm not a UFO guy, I'm not a huge paranormal guy. 349 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:22,000 I had just returned from a two-year tour in Iraq, so I didn't really know much about any of that. 350 00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:31,000 I got my first marching orders to go to Skinwalker Ranch. 351 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:37,000 We were primed that we would be some sort of a paranormal investigative team 352 00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:42,000 and document these events that seemed to be taking place on the ranch. 353 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:52,000 We were advised to document anything that was out of the ordinary, anything that seemed anomalous. 354 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:58,000 I went out a lot by myself, taken a lot of pictures. 355 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:07,000 I knew the ranch in the six years probably better than anybody else. 356 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:12,000 From every cave there is, to the valleys, to the river area. 357 00:36:16,000 --> 00:36:21,000 There was constantly a feeling of being watched. 358 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:27,000 Almost like a presence of something you couldn't see. 359 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:34,000 The phenomena, whatever it was, absolutely in control. 360 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:41,000 It seemed to know how we were going to respond before events occurred. 361 00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:47,000 It started slow by somebody just banging on the door or opening the door, 362 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:50,000 and then you would go out and there's nobody there. 363 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:57,000 For somebody it sounded like they had a stick and went around the metal skirting of the back quarters 360. 364 00:36:57,000 --> 00:36:59,000 When you go out, there's nothing. 365 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:05,000 But the crowning event was, it was about 10.30 at night, and I was writing a report. 366 00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:10,000 And I hear the front door being thrown open. 367 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:15,000 You can clearly hear somebody behind me. 368 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:20,000 You can not only hear it, but you can also feel the ground move. 369 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:23,000 You could feel the vibration of the ground. 370 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:30,000 And whatever thing that was, walked through the entire house, opened the back door, 371 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,000 and then you could hear him walk down the stairs. 372 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,000 You can see the stairs, it would really move. 373 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:42,000 I stopped at some point trying to find a smoking gun. 374 00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:46,000 I just wanted to document as well as I could. 375 00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:53,000 Skinwalker Ranch, poltergeist activity, weird creatures, all in one area. 376 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,000 We know about Robert Bigelow and his connection to Skinwalker Ranch, 377 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:03,000 and he just happens to be the guy who was awarded the contract for OSAP, 378 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:06,000 which turned into some kind of UFO research program. 379 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:13,000 In July of 2007, a guy in Washington at the DIA, he's a physicist, a rocket scientist, 380 00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:16,000 writes a letter to Robert Bigelow, and he says, 381 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:20,000 hey, I'm so-and-so, I work for the Defense Intelligence Agency, 382 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:24,000 I've heard about the Skinwalker Ranch, I'd like to visit the property and see it for myself. 383 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,000 Writes this letter to Bigelow, Bigelow gets it, he calls Harry Reid. 384 00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,000 One day, Bigelow called the police, 385 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:39,000 one day Bigelow called me, he said, I got the damnedest letter, I wanted you to see it. 386 00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:44,000 And so I read the letter, and I said, this is something I think is interesting, 387 00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:49,000 it came from a reliable source, I said I don't know the man, never heard of him. 388 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:55,000 But I said, I will contact him, after meeting with him several times, I called Bigelow, 389 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:59,000 and he said, I think you should give this guy permission to go to your Skinwalker Ranch. 390 00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:05,000 Bigelow invites the guy out, they fly together to the ranch, 391 00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:10,000 they're there for maybe hour, hour and a half, within 10, 15 minutes of being on the property, 392 00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:16,000 this guy has an experience, and it seems to have been tailor-made for him. 393 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:21,000 Something appears in this room, and it's something that only he can see. 394 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:29,000 He goes back to Washington, he meets with Reid again, tells him about it, 395 00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:35,000 Reid arranges a meeting in a skiff under the Capitol, a secure facility, 396 00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:40,000 and the scientist meets with Reid and Daniel Inouye and Ted Stevens, 397 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:45,000 and they talk about, should we put some money together and study this? 398 00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:48,000 Short is one of the easiest cells I ever had to make, 399 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:54,000 because Ted Stevens immediately said, good, when I was in the Army Air Corps, 400 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:59,000 I went up one time, and there was a vehicle off to my left, 401 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:04,000 and I would go up and down, and did everything he could to shake that object, 402 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:09,000 and he asked the people on the ground, what was that? 403 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,000 They said, we didn't see anything. 404 00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:15,000 So he said, I'm in favor of this. 405 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,000 So that's where we got the $22 million. 406 00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:24,000 Stevens said yes, Inouye said yes, Reid says yes, and it was a done deal. 407 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:28,000 Signed it in September of 2008, and they were off to the races. 408 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:36,000 Bigelow recruits scientists, private investigators, former cop and military folks, 409 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:40,000 and then they start investigating cases. 410 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,000 Boots on the ground, interview the witnesses, collect physical evidence, 411 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,000 put it together in reports. 412 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:52,000 And he hired out a whole lot of scientists and experts to work on various aspects of this issue, 413 00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,000 and papers were written by them. 414 00:40:54,000 --> 00:41:03,000 38 papers to look at aerospace and scientific breakthrough technologies 50 years in advance. 415 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:07,000 Can we duplicate what we've seen UFOs do? 416 00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:12,000 Can we in 50 years create a plane that's invisible? 417 00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:15,000 Can we go through a wormhole? 418 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:22,000 They put together a gigantic pile of information, 99% of which the public has not seen. 419 00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,000 So I released a couple of them. 420 00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:29,000 Detection and high resolution tracking vehicles at hypersonic velocities. 421 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:33,000 This is by Dr. Bill Culbreth at UNLV. 422 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:37,000 2009, that was pie in the sky, that's far off in the future. 423 00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:41,000 Now, we know in the last couple of months, Putin has boasted they've got hypersonic missiles. 424 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:44,000 They cannot be stopped. 425 00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:47,000 Bill Culbreth writes the paper 11 years ago that says, 426 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:52,000 here's what our capabilities are, we need to get started on this. 427 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:55,000 There's no UFO that's mentioned in that report. 428 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:59,000 But it is talking about objects that travel really fast, and how do we track them? 429 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,000 You can see how that could be applied to the study of UFOs. 430 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:24,000 That part of me is still on watch. 431 00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:32,000 I was a top gun graduate, senior air controller, had 18 years of sea time. 432 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:38,000 This encounter profoundly affected me. 433 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:41,000 I went through some really hard times because of it. 434 00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,000 I had changed, it changed me. 435 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,000 And everyone around me noticed it. 436 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:55,000 I started having nightmares of the eschatological type, like end of the world type nightmares, out of the blue. 437 00:42:55,000 --> 00:43:00,000 I didn't know what it was causing it, but it started to affect my work, it started to affect my marriage. 438 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:03,000 I ended up losing everything I had. 439 00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:14,000 Your real view is shattered, and I thought maybe I was even going crazy. 440 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:22,000 I had actually returned back to my hometown, back in Keeb-Jumption, Oregon, and I was volunteering at the local golf course, working in the kitchen. 441 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,000 It was December 17, 2017. 442 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:29,000 CNN was on TV. 443 00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:35,000 He saw the object, waves breaking over, and says he saw something hovering above it. 444 00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:37,000 The story comes on, the tic-tac video. 445 00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:42,000 It looks like a 40 foot long tic-tac with no wings. 446 00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:49,000 Someone is going to be hard for me. 447 00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:53,000 That moment rocked me. 448 00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:57,000 They showed the same video that I had in 2004. 449 00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:06,000 I knew in that moment, I knew in that moment that I had to talk, I had to speak up. 450 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:15,000 If you think about it, since 2004 to the present, the number of cases reported by Navy pilots and radar operators has definitely increased. 451 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,000 Why? 452 00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:19,000 Are you angry at the government? 453 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:20,000 No, not at all. 454 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,000 I'm not angry with my government. 455 00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:23,000 I don't hate my government. 456 00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,000 I support my government. 457 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:29,000 I don't hold anyone responsible for what happened to me personally. 458 00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:31,000 I don't have those feelings. 459 00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:40,000 Instead, what I do feel is I want to figure out what this thing is, and I think they want to be found. 460 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:45,000 And we're going to go find them. 461 00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:54,000 I am totally in favor of doing all the exploration we can on the world beyond our world. 462 00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:56,000 We must remain curious. 463 00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:04,000 Intellectually, we need to do everything we can to try to figure things out. 464 00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:12,000 I know that people, when I got started in this, thought that I was going into an area I shouldn't have. 465 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:14,000 What the hell is he doing on this? 466 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:23,000 But as time has gone on, even my wife, who wondered why I was so involved in unidentified flying objects, said to me a few months ago, 467 00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:30,000 you're not looking so bad now. 468 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:42,000 I am confident and I am cautiously optimistic that in the next year we are going to have a fundamentally different conversation than we're having today. 469 00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:57,000 I think there's going to be additional fidelity to a lot of the things that have come out recently that are going to help us have a better understanding of what it is we're actually seeing here. 470 00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:06,000 Throughout the decades, when it comes to the field of ufology, you see people at the top who are considered the leaders. 471 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:12,000 Based on the New York Times article, Luis Elizondo is one of those people. 472 00:46:12,000 --> 00:46:22,000 The day it was released, I had filed multiple Freedom of Information Act requests to try and get more information from the Pentagon, from the Department of Defense. 473 00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:27,000 The Pentagon gave me a no records response to my original request. 474 00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:35,000 Now what's really strange about that is I gave them Mr. Elizondo's name and he said, no, we got nothing. 475 00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:44,000 So I started drilling down looking into Mr. Elizondo's background. 476 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:51,000 He didn't have any background. There were very little things known about Mr. Elizondo as a person. 477 00:46:51,000 --> 00:47:01,000 Who was he? What was he really doing? Why is the Pentagon saying that is not what this program was? There was no UFO aspect to it. 478 00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:09,000 And then all of a sudden they said Mr. Elizondo had no assigned responsibilities on the A-Tip program. 479 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:19,000 The guy that you've been seeing on the news and nearly every publication on the planet that we call Earth, he did not lead that program. 480 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,000 What do you do with that? Who do you believe at that point? 481 00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:53,000 The Pentagon is a very important organization. 482 00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:57,000 We have a lot of people who are interested in the Pentagon. 483 00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:01,000 We have a lot of people who are interested in the Pentagon. 484 00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:05,000 We have a lot of people who are interested in the Pentagon. 485 00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:09,000 We have a lot of people who are interested in the Pentagon. 486 00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:13,000 We have a lot of people who are interested in the Pentagon. 487 00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:17,000 Thank you.